I met my husband three and a half years ago. We’ve been married for a year and a half. The first two years were absolute bliss. I was dating two other people when we met, and he was very supportive of me being poly, though he expressed that he wasn’t interested in adding partners for himself. I’ve been burned before, so this time I feel I did it right. From the start I was BRUTALLY honest. I wanted to be absolutely certain that he was, in fact, ok with me being poly. That he would tell me when he had concerns, and ask questions when he had them. I told him trivial things, like who texted me throughout the day, just so he would know how things were likely to go. I knew I was his first exposure to polyamory, so I didn’t want to make any assumptions at all.
Okay, so you’re off to a good start. Honesty, straightforwardness in communication. All of this is good.
Time went by and my secondary relationships went away. I made absolutely certain that he knew I did not end the relationships for him, but because they were no longer positive for me. I reiterated that I would still be pursuing a poly lifestyle and that it was just a toss of the dice that it was just he and I at the moment.
I’m going to pay you the compliment of presuming that when you say you are making something absolutely certain, that you used unambiguous language. i.e. “I am still polyamorous. Right now you are my only partner, but that could change.”
Or something equally as blunt.
After he proposed, I made sure to bring up the topic again, stating that I would still be polyamorous, that my commitment to him did not rule out the possibility of me finding other secondary relationships. He seemed to understand. He seemed quite honest. He seemed very supportive. So we married.
About 3 months in, I met someone that I absolutely adored. I enjoyed the emotional fuzzies, but did not act on it, as I felt focusing on my new marriage would be the best for the situation.
The object of my affections was not informed of my feelings. Another 3 months or so went by before I decided, no, this is not a passing infatuation, so I brought it up to my dear husband, but did not mention names (partly because of his newness to poly, partly because, inside, I’m chicken). Turns out, this was a good thing, because my husband exploded. He couldn’t believe that I could even think such a thing. Hadn’t I made my decision when I married him?
I was blindsided, shocked even. I had been absolutely clear, to the point that I thought bringing it up again would result in, “Oh, come on, you’ve told me a million times already…”
Hmm… If what you say is so, and you accepted his proposal still reiterating that you intended to be non-exclusive after the marriage, I’m gonna have to say that this fella was indulging in some wishful thinking.
We tried to talk about boundaries. What does he need, what do I need, but mostly he just got hurt and upset every time I brought it up. I continue to bring it up again about once a month, just to try and make progress.
As far as due diligence, and bringing it up, it sounds like you’ve been doing what you needed to do.
A year later, I still have feelings for the object of my affections (OOA), this person reveals feelings for me, and we discuss what that means. OOA doesn’t want to break up a marriage, or do anything at all until Husband is absolutely clear on what he wants.
Let me be clear, polyamory is one of my personal requirements for a relationship. I will NOT date you if I cannot also date other men and women. Other boundaries are flexible, this is not. I would not have married Husband had I known he would react like this, but you know what they say about hindsight…
So, the long-awaited question, how long do I wait for him to be ok with something we discussed three and a half years ago? Or should I cut and run? He still expresses a desire to work on things, and I have seen a few (very small) changes. Normally, this would mean that both of us are willing to work on the relationship and it’s still a go. But how do I know I won’t wake up, thirty years from now, still claiming to be poly, but having been monogamous my whole life because he’s just “not quite ready yet”? (exaggeration, I know, I’m freaking out a little…) Please help! Any advice would help at this point, I’m going insane.
I don’t know that you need any advice. You’ve said that non-exclusivity is a non-negotiable for you. I don’t know how much more clear you can be.
I sympathize with your dilemma. I had something similar happen when I married. Before marriage, my finance was all, “Of course I want kids.” After marriage? No. He didn’t want kids, not ever.
I thought having kids was a non-negotiable. It turned out that when I examined it, I wanted to be married to my husband more than I wanted children, and yeah, I did make a hard cold decision about it. I did luck out, as he changed his mind, but I cannot urge you strongly enough to think really carefully about this, as you can’t count on him changing his mind. He may never, and if you’re not okay with never, it’s time to fish or cut bait my dear. It sounds to me like you’re not really okay with it. The real question is, “Are you okay with being with your husband as is he is right now?” There’s no reward for being Patient Griselda here, and neither of you are going to benefit from being the Brave Little Toaster and live the lives you want to.
I am so sorry to say that, as I wish I could give you some sort of happy poly ending story.
I see what you’re saying, and I appreciate the wisdom in it. I talked him into going to a couples therapist, (our first appointment is tomorrow) so hopefully we’ll figure it out together. I guess I’ve known for a while that I’m supposed to “fish or cut bait” as you said, I just really hate hurting other people, and breakups suck. Being poly is a hard boundary for me, and I can’t be any more honest than I have been, so he’s going to have to be clear whether he really is getting used to it, or just dragging me along. I’ll post more after the counseling. Thanks again!
To the questioner:
I seriously read this letter with slight incredulity, because I could have written it myself, pretty much down to the details.
How my situation worked out — I had a 12-year partnership with my former husband, we raised my daughter together, we’re still good friends who care for each other . . . but he *never* became truly okay with poly, and it was a major problem in our relationship.
We broke up mostly for other reasons (he’s a homebody and a bit of a misanthrope, I’m a social butterfly who is energized by other people, loves to travel, etc., and we eventually wound up going in different life directions), but I’m not going to lie, the poly issue was with us from Day One, and it created a wedge that fostered distance between us.
I started out like you, very open about the fact that I was a poly person, that this was non-negotiable, etc. He agreed, said he wanted a “non-exclusive” relationship, etc. Turned out he meant “non-exclusive until he decided that we’re Serious About Each Other,” at which point I was expected to stop wanting to be involved with other people.
I wrote our marriage vows to be non-exclusive, and he vetted them and agreed to them. But when I wanted to begin a relationship with someone else (after, like you, a period of “default monogamy” because I didn’t have any other current partners, although I continued to periodically remind him that I was still poly and I still was open to other relationships), he flipped his shit.
We worked things out, but what wound up happening was that my other relationships became compartmentalized from my home life, and because he didn’t really want to hear about my other partners (he was okay with poly-DADT, basically), I started to not be able to talk to him about important parts of my life. That created a distance which eventually became hard to bridge.
I sincerely wish you luck in getting your husband to come around, since you’ve been very straightforward about how you’ve presented this to him (and I hope that the couples’ counseling will help), but . . . I’m going to tell you, I wish I had known that my former husband was *never* going to stop his wishful thinking that I would become monogamous — because I would never have moved in with or married him.
I don’t consider the relationship a failure because we ended things respectfully and with love, and he’s still an important part of my/my daughter’s life . . . but I would have spared both of us a lot of pain and heartache if I had taken a harder line about poly being non-negotiable (which I DID say), and also that if he continued to push for monogamy despite our having made an initial agreement (initiated by HIM, even!) to be non-monogamous, I was going to regretfully have to end the relationship.
**hugs & good luck**
— A <3
Ashbet, wow, your story does sound remarkably close to mine. I also wrote our vows to be non-exclusive. I’m already having to keep important parts of my life from him (his choice, not mine). I have a couple of friends that I dated a long time ago, and the thought of me having ever been with them makes him uncomfortable to the point that he doesn’t want me to talk about them.
I remember the first few talks we had about polyamory. He was new to it, so I kept using the phrase “This is not something that’s going to go away, it’s a part of who I am.” I lost count of the times I said that to him. I wish he had listened. Thanks for sharing your story! It helps to know I’m not alone. 🙂
-K-
I backed off my poly-ness when my then-boyfriend flipped out when I started The Honest Discussion. I backed down, not thinking at the time that I would be where I am now, 18 years later with a husband and teenager and a growing constitutional discomfort because I am not being who I actually [spell-check almost made it “acutely,” which also fits] am, and avoiding that true self for my husband’s sake. Don’t find yourself in my position years later trying to figure out how to say, You remember x years back when I said I was poly/non-monogamous? Honey, we need to talk…..
“I’m already having to keep important parts of my life from him (his choice, not mine). I have a couple of friends that I dated a long time ago, and the thought of me having ever been with them makes him uncomfortable to the point that he doesn’t want me to talk about them.”
If nothing else, this is a HUGE red flag. Please, PLEASE talk to your counselor about this part — retroactive jealousy/territoriality is NOT okay, and it can turn into controlling and manipulative behavior pretty quickly. (“I don’t want you to talk about those people because you used to sleep together” can turn into “I don’t want you to SEE those people because you used to sleep together” pretty quickly.)
Your friends are your friends, and you have nothing to apologize for. If he’s uncomfortable with the fact that some of those friends are former partners, that’s his issue to work out, not yours to “appease” him by avoiding discussions that concern them.
(Just to be clear — I don’t always want to hear extremely explicit sexual detail of my partners’ former lovers. That’s not what I’m talking about — it’s OK to set a boundary of “Hey, I know you guys used to be together, and that’s fine with me, but I really don’t need to know what you did in bed.” But that is not at all what this sounds like. He sounds possessive and insecure, and I am hoping that his attempts to make you uncomfortable talking about these friends doesn’t eventually turn into attempts to get you to give up the friendships to “prove that he’s most important in your life” or some other hogwash.)
**hugs** Good luck, and I hope and pray that the counseling will be beneficial for the two of you.
— A <3
Something I really advocate for these “Yes I’m poly and always will be, do you truly get it?” discussions is to ask your listener to repeat back when you just said. Out of their own mouths. As in, “Could you repeat back how you understand that, so that I can check how you heard it?”
It’s amazing how, as they say it, they may start looking all surprised and stuttery on hearing the words out of their own mouths. Like they’re hearing the words for the first time. In fact, maybe they are. Wishful thinking makes people deaf — but people always hear what *they themselves* say.
Also, putting an agreement in writing and you both signing it is good on several levels. It makes it feel more real and “official” at the time. It’s insurance against honest memory lapses and disputes over memories. And the knowledge that it’s on paper tends to keep people honest.
> I also wrote our vows to be non-exclusive.
Sounds like you DID put it in writing then! (more or less). Did he agree to the vows?
I say stand your ground now. If he thinks marriage entitles him to make new assumptions and demands contrary to your understandings on this issue, he may do so on some other issue, and another.
Best wishes,
Alan M.
> I also wrote our vows to be non-exclusive.
Sounds like you DID put it in writing then! (more or less). Did he agree to the vows?
Not to be critical of the OP’s vows (I mean I haven’t even read them!) but I think that in general there’s an important distinction to be made between vows that simply make a point not to mention exclusivity and vows that make an explicit mention of polyamory or agreeing to and supporting other loves and relationships.
I know that in my case we did explicitly decide not to put anything about exclusivity into our wedding vows. But we also didn’t explicitly mention polyamory or having other loves. I don’t feel like I’m breaking any vows by turning out NOT to be able to support his other love because I didn’t promise I would. Of course he also didn’t break any by finding another love. Where does that leave us? Well, we still need to work it out between us somehow. But at least neither one of us is pointing to those vows saying “But you promised!!”.
And I think that if he HAD asked to put something explicit in the vows about being supportive of other loves I would have balked at it because I wasn’t in a place to be able to make such a positive declaration. Fortunately in my case I don’t think poly is quite as mandatory as it seems to be for the OP.
To Alan – yes he did agree to the vows.
Yesterday was our first counseling session. I feel that it went really well, even though it was mostly an introductory session. Neither of us felt comfortable bringing up polyamory in this session, but we both really like the counselor, so it will probably happen next week. I did make sure that she received the copy of “What Psychology Professionals Should Know About Polyamory” that I sent with the receptionist last week.
I feel like my husband really opened up and I think that we will most definitely make progress now. Even if that progress is deciding that we shouldn’t be together, at least it will be a conscious decision and not blindly ignoring how each other feels. (Though I really hope that we stay together.)
Thanks for all the input, everyone! If anything major happens, I’ll be sure and post it.
Hugs!
-K-
Thanks for the update, hon! Keeping my fingers crossed for you! <3
dammit. i wrote a really thoughtful reply and it has disappeared. now i don’t remember what i wanted to add. poop.
My story is pretty much the same, and it ended in divorce and bad things and he is still bitter about the polyamory even though he agreed to it in the beginning and waffled drastically back and forth during our marriage. What I find, and I think PM has written about it before, is that a lot of people think that once the relationship gets serious polyamory will no longer be a thing. My ex husband thought that because monogamy was the default right way of being married, that gave him the right to revert our relationship back to it whenever he liked. He too, asked me to give him time, and here is my advice for you about that: Do not waste your years giving him time. Set a solid deadline of not more than half a year (mine was 3months) by which point he must come to an unqualified decision whether he can handle polyamory or not. No “okay I can handle it but DADT” no “I can handle it I just need you to not have sex with anyone else for a while” NO EXTRA QUALIFIERS. Full poly or no poly.
If he says he can’t handle it, get divorced and find someone who can. Similar things have happened to me so many times that I refuse to date anyone who isn’t already poly or so thoroughly surrounded by poly people that I know they know the deal. YMMV, but I highly recommend the policy.
IF he says he can handle polyamory, communicate clearly that there is a three strikes policy, and it is based on your perception of his behavior, which he honestly may not even be aware of. If he is passive aggressive about poly, if he is inexplicably grumpy and won’t talk to you or touch you after you return from a date, if he finds ways to sabotage your time with other partners, even if he just asks you for an annoying amount if attention before and after dates so he can feel more important. . .any of that kind if crap means he was lying, to you, maybe also to himself. Don’t put up with it. Don’t allow him to do it to you. Get out and find someone who doesn’t treat you that way for being who you are.
I think I agree with the principle of this comment, but not some of the details. I’ve always tried to give my life partner some extra focused attention (cuddles, making a point to tell her how beautiful she is, whatever she seems to need) for the period around when I have a date with somebody else.
But yeah, if the poly thing is absolutely mandatory for you, and you’re sure you can’t cope with giving it up, then don’t make yourself miserable waiting for him to change; insist on seeing that things are getting better within something like six months.
For me, it’s not quite as mandatory, though it’s much easier for me to not look for new partners or accept attention from people who might be fun, than it is to give up a partner I already have strong feelings for. :-/
Hello everyone! Update from our second counseling session:
We got very lucky with our counselor, not only is she very good, but she’s completely open to polyamory and trying to learn more about it as she goes along. I think having a neutral third party to our discussions is making a lot of things much more clear to each of us. We made more progress today than we have in the last 6 months put together.
I don’t want to get into details of the session, but I will say that I finally feel like we’re on an upward climb. I feel like I will get to start being myself again very soon. Husband is actually working on being ok with specific boundaries within our relationship. He’s not just stringing me along with wishful thinking.
I got to tell him how important it is to me that we come to an agreement sooner rather than later, and how I don’t have much patience left in me. (After three and a half years, can you blame me?) He was insistent that we work together to stretch his boundaries so that we can both be happy in this relationship. He wants to just dig right in and get to all the hard stuff instead of inching through like we have been. He’s even agreed to set up a ‘date’ with me once a week in addition to the counseling so that we can work on boundaries and polyamory specifically.
I must say, I’m very pleased with how well this is working out. After being in pre-apocalypse mode for so long, thinking of all the horrible things that could go wrong (like the worry-wart I can be), it’s very nice to have things run smoothly.
So, fear not fellow poly peeps! There is hope! Grown-ups CAN communicate and work through shit together. Yay!
I want to say thanks to all the people that commented and helped me through this (Mama Java especially ^_^). This is a wonderful website, and I don’t know what I’d do without it.
Hugs!
-K-
YAAAAAAY!!!!!
I’m so happy to hear it!! 😀
Just curious for a status update from the OP/Questioner… I’m in a similar boat at the moment. (Explains why I’m here, anyway!)